What it takes to fire up a Volt

Alternative energy sources
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The usual. As I have two large solar PV systems here, and my lab assistant just put one in, and others are interested in things like this, here's where that stuff goes. This is mostly for things that work now, not "gee someday a fusor will do this" -- we know that, but it's not someday yet.
The hope is to save anyone embarking on this sort of thing a lot of wasted time and money, as at least I have been off the grid since 1980 and have had a lot of practice (and made mistakes you won't have to).

What it takes to fire up a Volt

Postby Doug Coulter » Thu Jan 26, 2012 4:42 pm

Not talking about the flame stickers I got for mine, but the real deal here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jqLctOu9vCQ

Pretty brutal test - but it took a few tries to get a fire in 3 weeks after the test.
Here's the same test on a prius. Note dummy's head in this one - glad I got a Volt.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_UgaGDV-Ge4
Posting as just me, not as the forum owner. Everything I say is "in my opinion" and YMMV -- which should go for everyone without saying.
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Re: What it takes to fire up a Volt

Postby chrismb » Fri Jan 27, 2012 11:53 am

I'm very impressed at the air-bag deployment in both cases. Very good! I'd do a straight swap for either, if someone wants my 2000 model banger.

I think the relative motion of the head in the car is somewhat an artifice of the test, due to different CoG of the cars. The Volt looks to be front-heavy. You might note that the Volt is caused to rotate as it hits the pole, whereas the Prius pretty much stops dead. So both heads would've got the same impact (they are doing the same speed) and I think probably 'bounce back' (viz. shock to the head) is much the same. But in the Volt's case, the motion of the car back away from the pole means that the relative motion of head and car are not so pronounced.
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Re: What it takes to fire up a Volt

Postby Doug Coulter » Fri Jan 27, 2012 3:10 pm

What I *think* I saw here was the the pole impacts the Volt at the lower door sill first, which is stiffer than the Prius (and why the underseat stiffener was pushed into the battery), and gave the airbags more time to deploy before the car rocked up to the place where the pole broke the window. The driver's head hadn't moved as far toward that window first, and the airbag deployed more ahead of the flying glass and before the head hit it. A tiny difference to be sure - but the driver of the Prius is almost certainly suffering a broken neck or extreme whiplash here. The Volt is a bit front heavy, it's 50-something/40-something if I remember the numbers I saw - close to 60/40. More so than the Camaro (which was 52/48) but less than most FWD cars (The Cruze) due to the batteries in middle and back.

This IS the crash that resulted in the (3 week) later fire, BTW. NHTSA of course didn't do all the normal safety junk, and in their defense - no human was ever at any risk anyway, why waste more of our tax dollars?
Turned out this was so hard to replicate that two more full car crashes and two battery only tests couldn't get it to happen again. Then they just impaled a battery with a piece of re-bar and flooded it with coolant to get one more to go up - a week later.

For me - I think there are more important things to worry about in that level of crash. I kind of doubt I wrap mine around a pole like that - it's actually almost impossible to get this thing sideways on purpose, that skid control stuff is outstanding (if you like things like that). In a T bone - the other car's center of force - bumper, won't extend so low as to hit the door sill anyway - there would be other issues.

Someone on the GM-Volt board recently totaled one by hitting a Corvette in the side (Vette blew a stop sign) - no fire, no injuries and it was really totaled. All these cars are so much better that way than the '66 Plymouth I lost my front teeth to a steering wheel in in a 10 mph rear ending it's not funny.
Posting as just me, not as the forum owner. Everything I say is "in my opinion" and YMMV -- which should go for everyone without saying.
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Re: What it takes to fire up a Volt

Postby chrismb » Sat Jan 28, 2012 11:57 am

Yup, in this instant I would definitely prefer the Volt. But you can never really know. I was involved in exactly this type of accident about 20 years ago. Slid on black ice and hit a telegraph pole directly to the drivers door. I wish I had a picture of the car after that - it really was a "My God - did the driver live?" kinda banana shape. The telegraph pole was fully right in the middle of the driver's seat.

Funnily enough, for some reason I will never be able to explain, I had not put my seatbelt on. Had I done so, my hips would've become the same width as the driver's seat ended up as - which was 6 inches wide! - It looks a bit like that for the poor Prius dummy here, had it not been strapped in, maybe it would've not taken such a twist to the spine.

I'd simply not have lived had I been wearing my seatbelt that night. As it was, I was pushed (bounced!?) sideways and ended up on the lap of a passenger I had with me. I'm glad he was OK. I broke my arm and have a pin in it to this day. The Policeman that attended asked a few cursory questions. It is/was [technically] an offence not to wear a seatbelt and it was blindingly obvious that I had not been wearing it, for the simple reason that I was alive! He knew that as much as I did. So he said "I am going to ask you a question and I will note your answer - were you wearing your seatbelt?". I said "Yes". He ticked the box and no more was said.

Would I have wanted to swap my tin-can 80's car that icy night for one of these lovely modern cars - you betcha!! Accidents never happen like you expect. There again, it is better to be lucky than be in a good car with a fantastic NCAP rating ..... but a good car is a good start!
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Re: What it takes to fire up a Volt

Postby Doug Coulter » Mon Jan 30, 2012 7:37 pm

I have to admit after having been in some crashes, that I'm a huge fan of belts. I lost my teeth in the only one I had that was my fault - lap belts only in a 66 plymouth valiant, 10 mph rear ender. Steering wheels don't taste real good. When shoulder belts came out - and they were nasty-uncomfortable at first - I was in love anyway.

I've heard a couple of stories where people say they'd have been hurt worse with one - but they are either ones I can discount (someone saved by being thrown clear for example, which usually will kill you - and we don't know how he'd have done if he'd stayed with the vehicle either) and stuff like that. You might merely have been pushed over the inside support, and no worse for wear, you never really know. I have seen cars vs poles where yes, essentially the back bumper now touched the front on that side - belt or not - that guy's dead. The trouble with the stories here is that "rebel without a cause" issue - people don't like being told what to do and rationalize the hell out of it - you can't believe their stories. I've either been in or seen (at the track) a lotta wrecks. Give me a belt. The numbers are far better.

When I got thrown clear of my kart, after rolling it, I was fine - till the kart came back out of the sky and landed on me. Had I been wearing its belts - I'd have been mad, but just hanging upside down. I broke 6 ribs in that one. That really hurt. No laughing, coughing, farting - anything, for a couple months without extreme pain.

I have no idea about airbags. I think people just drive stupider as a result, like with ABS brakes, and make up for any extra "safety" they confer. In that Prius - it was the airbag that almost tore the dummy's head off - and had he not been belted, his inertia would have pushed him into it even harder! I have my doubts...but I've never been in a situation where one went off. Had the prius bag gone sooner - he'd have been better off hitting an already inflated bag rather than being launched by the inflation, I think. Hmm.

In a similar accident - we were T boned by a little old lady blowing a stopsign, from the right - my passenger who was alert unbuckled and hopped into my (the drivers) lap and escaped injury. The back seat passenger was not alert, was belted, and when that side of the car got pushed in (about a foot) she got a bruise, but nothing more - there is some give in all that, and if the mount itself is being moved by the wreck, as it did in that case, and almost certainly in yours - it's ok, for the data I have so far. In any case, though both cars were totalled (we were going 50+ and just tore the front half off her car when she hit us) - I drove mine - a pontiac compact - home and to a gig I had that night, with no glass on that side. Pushed in a foot, but still drove fine! Those things are tough. That's one of the things GM gets right, they make them too heavy - but they put the weight where it makes you safer. In a headon with a GM wagon and a Nissan - she died, none of us were even bruised. Guess people shouldn't top blind hills on the wrong side of the road at 70 mph, eh? I hit the ditch - and she hit me head on in the ditch! About 120mph total speed. Now that was one loud bang. Tore the right front wheel off (remember, we drive on the other side here) and I still had velocity. I now know why the last words on all flight recorders are some variation on "oh shit". I've still got 35, and I'm heading towards a very unforgiving dirt bank head on, with only 3 wheels.
Steering doesn't work. Brakes gone. E brake no good (never is) - heck I think I adjusted the radio and tried the lighter - it's like time has really slowed and by god, you try everything. Then we hit the bank at 35. That hurt a lot more than bouncing off a nissan did. Lucky, the friend playing saxophone in the back seat took it out of his mouth first or he'd have been hurt. As it is, he saved the son of the girl who hit us, just before her car went over a cliff - and he's now a neighbour of ours, and a friend.

I've not managed to get this thing sideways yet - I've tried, too. Have to disable the traction control stuff which is pretty awesome in operation, but again, I'm not sure that makes the car safer - people will just drive even dumber. I don't go fast when there's any possibility of ice anyway! (and the damn nanny computer speaks up and tells you when there might be ice - down looking IR thermometer) That might manage it. But in any other circumstance, you're going to hit what you're aimed at - it's phenomenal at that - or be hit by someone. Of course, most people don't drive around with vertical 6" infinitely stiff poles on their cars, but would hit you low with their bumper (hopefully they were braking at the time so the bumper is real low), where the car is obviously very strong.

At any rate, I just found those vids and thought they'd be interesting, nice slow mo of a pretty hard crash. FWIW, a guy on the volt forums did total one into a Corvette - which flew to pieces, little chunks of fiberglass everywhere. No one was hurt, and nothing caught on fire either. There have been to date (that I know of) 6 total loss crashes in these in 25 million car miles "in the real world" and zero fires yet.

They'll be hitting your shores soon as the Ampera (and they're better looking cars).
Posting as just me, not as the forum owner. Everything I say is "in my opinion" and YMMV -- which should go for everyone without saying.
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Re: What it takes to fire up a Volt

Postby Doug Coulter » Tue Jan 31, 2012 8:22 pm

Not really on topic, but a heck of a lot of fun sometimes to watch cars explode. Here's a couple I ran across while looking for something else.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LmRkPyue ... re=related
Ford focus at 120 mph vs concrete wall


Smart car, concrete wall:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9iKGfo1w ... re=related


But wait! There's more! Chinese truck at 40 mph:
Damn impressive crumple zone...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D827IxEJ ... ure=fvwrel


'59 belair vs '09 mailbu:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fPF4fBGN ... re=related
Guess you want a newer car.


Ten really extreme tests:
Sticks and stones may break my bones but whips and chains excite me
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-x3UTROQ ... re=related


Wow, if only they'd sold more than the about 4k cars of these before the Volt tests maybe we wouldn't have had such a furor - oh, wait...

Gotta have some pure fun. Geek takes hot mom in a real hot rod.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nw-fgKuo ... re=related


There appears to be a new fad out there of taking large breasted women out in very hot cars and seeing if you can expose their rack with the gees.
Must...do...more...research...

NSFW, but by far, not the most extreme: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aGKjFkeM ... ure=relmfu
Posting as just me, not as the forum owner. Everything I say is "in my opinion" and YMMV -- which should go for everyone without saying.
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